Tuesday, November 24, 2009
An elder and his children...
As I think about the kind of men God raises up to be elders, I am again reminded that the most controversial discussion is generally about his kids: are they "believers", how many are baptized, are they active when they leave home, and on and on. It seems to me there are two basic approaches to this. The first focuses on the process. Did the elder seem to do the right thing in how he raised his children? Tied in to this is the question of adult children. Were they faithful while at home? To focus on the process implies that an elder cannot be responsible for the result, just the process. And he certainly cannot be help responsible for children grown and out on their own.
The other approach would be to focus on the result. Are his children faithful Christians? This approach implies the process will produce faithful children. It would see adult children as perhaps the truest measure of his parenting.
I am struck by the connection in Scripture between managing his household and the church. It seems to imply that the church under his leadership will look like his children. I strongly lean toward this approach. If you want to know how Southern Hills will look under my leadership, just look at my kids. In fact, I would argue that is the truest picture of the man you would have lead you. My kids are my elder portfolio. That is also why I wouldn't serve till my kids were grown. They needed a Dad more than church needed an elder. And I thought my kids should be a "finished product" first. By that, I mean that most of my work as a Dad was finished when they left home.
So, personally, I would not serve if either of my kids left the faith. I don't think they are perfect, and they have their areas of weakness. And they have had their spiritual battles. But they are faithful. And I not even sure I did the process well. I loved much, prayed hard, and tried to be authentic about my faith (and about my struggles to be the man God called me to be). And yes -- Marsha should get most of the credit for how they turned out. I guess that is the kind of elder I am: love much, pray hard, be authentic with my faith in front of my flock. And know that Marsha is a really good partner in this.
I am not dogmatic about this. I serve with men who struggle with where their children are spiritually. I support their study of Scripture and their decision. Just sharing my thoughts on the matter.
By the way, for those wondering... the nomination process is complete at Southern Hills and those men nominated are deciding to go to the next step or not. Pray for these men to know the call of God in their life. Me too.
Anyway, just my thoughts. Feel free to weigh in on elder's and their kids.
The other approach would be to focus on the result. Are his children faithful Christians? This approach implies the process will produce faithful children. It would see adult children as perhaps the truest measure of his parenting.
I am struck by the connection in Scripture between managing his household and the church. It seems to imply that the church under his leadership will look like his children. I strongly lean toward this approach. If you want to know how Southern Hills will look under my leadership, just look at my kids. In fact, I would argue that is the truest picture of the man you would have lead you. My kids are my elder portfolio. That is also why I wouldn't serve till my kids were grown. They needed a Dad more than church needed an elder. And I thought my kids should be a "finished product" first. By that, I mean that most of my work as a Dad was finished when they left home.
So, personally, I would not serve if either of my kids left the faith. I don't think they are perfect, and they have their areas of weakness. And they have had their spiritual battles. But they are faithful. And I not even sure I did the process well. I loved much, prayed hard, and tried to be authentic about my faith (and about my struggles to be the man God called me to be). And yes -- Marsha should get most of the credit for how they turned out. I guess that is the kind of elder I am: love much, pray hard, be authentic with my faith in front of my flock. And know that Marsha is a really good partner in this.
I am not dogmatic about this. I serve with men who struggle with where their children are spiritually. I support their study of Scripture and their decision. Just sharing my thoughts on the matter.
By the way, for those wondering... the nomination process is complete at Southern Hills and those men nominated are deciding to go to the next step or not. Pray for these men to know the call of God in their life. Me too.
Anyway, just my thoughts. Feel free to weigh in on elder's and their kids.
Comments:
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Steve,
I'm really enjoying your blog, especially your excellent thoughts on elders. I've been blessed to be a shepherd sine 2003. I'd appreciate your honest thoughts about my situation. I'm sure many other men have similar stories. We've raised four great kids, largely due to my beautiful wife's marvelous work as a mom. All of our kids deeply love Jesus. But the youngest two feel no loyalty to the "Church of Christ". One is a leader in a house church and the other is very involved in a church called "Experience Life". To be honest, they are probably more spiritually minded, and in love with Jesus and practicing a sacrificial life style than I am. But i can't support much of what they believe. Talks with them have not gone particularly well, largely because I get frustrated too easily. We've agreed to disagree. How would this effect your ministry as an "elder" if this was your situation?
This question has really been disturbing me and I would appreciate you honest feelings. Thanks for being my friend and mentor all these years. hope you have a Happy Thanksgiving with your family!
love in Christ, Richard
I'm really enjoying your blog, especially your excellent thoughts on elders. I've been blessed to be a shepherd sine 2003. I'd appreciate your honest thoughts about my situation. I'm sure many other men have similar stories. We've raised four great kids, largely due to my beautiful wife's marvelous work as a mom. All of our kids deeply love Jesus. But the youngest two feel no loyalty to the "Church of Christ". One is a leader in a house church and the other is very involved in a church called "Experience Life". To be honest, they are probably more spiritually minded, and in love with Jesus and practicing a sacrificial life style than I am. But i can't support much of what they believe. Talks with them have not gone particularly well, largely because I get frustrated too easily. We've agreed to disagree. How would this effect your ministry as an "elder" if this was your situation?
This question has really been disturbing me and I would appreciate you honest feelings. Thanks for being my friend and mentor all these years. hope you have a Happy Thanksgiving with your family!
love in Christ, Richard
Hey Richard. My first reaction is to say that I do affirm that they are believers. My kids are both in the Church of Christ, but we don't always agree on everything (daughter and family at SH with us, son and family at Richland Hils). For me, everything keys around gospel (death, burial, and resurrection). So if they are baptism, Lord's Supper people I am content. Doctrinal issues and worship practices may be important, but they are not core salvation issues in my mind. So my personal advice is to continue what you are doing with your kids. You don't have to endorse everything they believe, nor do they have to with you. But they are faithful followers of Christ.
The question of how it affects elder ministry is interesting. Elders are called to make decisions on doctrine and worship for their flock. I have always tried to be upfront about things with SH. Most of my flock knows I have a past, they know I split my tithe between SH and Herald of Truth, and they know where my kids go. If they still want me to serve, good. If now, OK. If you feel content (tho not happy) about your kids, then continue forward.
My folks are very supportive of my son and his spiritual journey, but they would never be part of Richland Hills. Even Southern Hills is a little difficult for them. And their church is for us. But we all support each other and are confident that the differences are not near as important as what we have in common.
You are one of my spiritual heroes. Maybe we can visit more about this some time.
Love you brother.
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The question of how it affects elder ministry is interesting. Elders are called to make decisions on doctrine and worship for their flock. I have always tried to be upfront about things with SH. Most of my flock knows I have a past, they know I split my tithe between SH and Herald of Truth, and they know where my kids go. If they still want me to serve, good. If now, OK. If you feel content (tho not happy) about your kids, then continue forward.
My folks are very supportive of my son and his spiritual journey, but they would never be part of Richland Hills. Even Southern Hills is a little difficult for them. And their church is for us. But we all support each other and are confident that the differences are not near as important as what we have in common.
You are one of my spiritual heroes. Maybe we can visit more about this some time.
Love you brother.
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